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intelligent virtual desktop (IVD)

  

KDE4 Brainstorm

Score 73%
intelligent virtual desktop (IVD)
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Link:  http://
Downloads:  65
Submitted:  Mar 18 2006
Updated:  Mar 18 2006

Description:

I use virtual desktops (VD) a lot and I've done so for over 15 years now. I use the VD with keyboard shortcuts and with the mouse roller. I also often “send” windows to another desktop. VD1 = development, VD2 = music, VD3 = surfing, VD3 = install + system work (till I started using Yakuake a lot) etc ..

I remember using a VD in Windows where the applications opened directly in the right VD. We also have sticky windows but those stick everywhere! Lately I've found myself wanting more intelligence from the system and I believe I have some ideas that could make VD and KDE4 more usable. As I am a developer, I enjoy being able to tweak and control my environment programmatically. “Simpler” users can be presented with a simple UI or can ignore the feature altogether.

In the screenshot you can see my first requirement for an IVD. Each letter corresponds to a program, a figure is added if another instance of the same program is running. Program A (say konqueror), has two instances (A, A2) but it is present 3 IVD for a total of 4 windows.

A is present in desktop 1 and in desktop 3 are the same instance but they have a different size and position. The same goes for A2 (in Desktop 2 and 3) and for C (in Desktop 1 and 4). Note that the applications are not sticky in all the desktops but only those where I want them to stick.

A good example of a program I want to have different positions is an irc client. When I'm chatting I want it to take much of my screen but I sometimes want to concentrate an have just a little not too disturbing window.

Below is a little wish list for an IVD, I would like to hear you opinion and, even more, what you would like to see in an IVD.

- position newly opened applications in the right VD or ask me if it should open it in the default location.
- sticky window per desktop not all the desktops
- set position and size as well as other attributes, for example remove the title bar of a window or, to be more generic, send a dcop command to the window allowing me to, not only, control the window but also the application in that specific DT.
- Remember the attributes of a window when I change VD, so I can resize a window and have it keep that size for the session or save it as default
- start application automatically when I access a specific VD
- possibility to have icons per VD (that would remove some clutter here :)
- lock applications in a desktop so they can't be moved nor duplicated
- allow me to duplicate any window I have open to any VD.
- the IVD should be accessible programatically so I can ask it on which VD and app is visible or duplicated (preferably dcop or such)
- have a script run every time the desktop is changed
- have a Kmenu per VD or at least have a specific sub menu
- possibility to merge all the VD, including icons
- incur no change to applications

This might sound complicated for the lambda user, but I'm not one of those and neither are you, since you are reading this, and neither are most of the users I know.

This could also be the first step towards the, long forgotten, “perfect” IDE which was not supposed to be one of the do-it-all IDE we have (eclipse or other bloatware) but where the desktop would be the IDE.



License:
free as ideas without implementations should be

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 Concept...

 
 by fatbuttlarry on: Mar 19 2006
 
Score 50%
fatbuttlarryfatbuttlarry
.blogspot.co m
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Love the idea... An option to have the same windows open on separate desktops with separate attributes...

Cool!

-FBL


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 Re: Concept...

 
 by nadim on: Mar 19 2006
 
Score 50%

Thank you. And since I'm a fast guy, it only took 15 years to write down ;)

The description was rather compact so I wouldn't bore people but there is more to than window attribute in this proposition. Being able to control the application, changing the view type, update rate, ..., makes it possible to have application attributes.

Also, controling the Desktop itself, icons, menu, alt-tab behaviour, dynamic background image, etc ... is also an important part of the concept.

** now, what do you want to see in an IVD? ** :)


Nadim
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 Re: Concept...

 
 by nadim on: Mar 19 2006
 
Score 50%

I was reading you mail for the third time when it hit me that there is more than the VD involved here. How we open applications must change.

when I open an app do I:

- want to open it in all the VD where it's supposed to be?

- want to open it here and that's all

- want to open it here in a shape, position defined in a list I can easilly define? hmm, this is difficult to explain but think about the "open with" entry but instead "Open in shape, size"

- want to open it in a certain "application state"? This is already possible through scripts and different icons but there is no single place for doing this.

Maybe some usability king or queen could tell us if this is great or bad.(though usability people consider us to be unadvanced small green monkeys sometimes :)


Nadim.
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 Re: Re: Concept...

 
 by anytimeIsLunchtime on: Mar 19 2006
 
Score 50%

I'm a usability court jester ---I still have to graduate--- so I've read a 'few' books on usability. I will leave a few remarks, for what it's worth. It's just my 2 cents.


- want to open it in all the VD where it's supposed to be?

If you have defined predestined desktops for certain tasks then yes, this could be correct behaviour. (Only for advanced users.) But we have a special case with browsers/file managers... where do they go?


- want to open it here and that's all

This is what I prefer. This placement-rule the most easy to comprehend. But I would like to change the rule KDE currently uses: I think that when I, for example, start konsole on desktop 3 then it needs to stay there. It should start on desktop 3 and not show up on my other desktops. I find that very confusing.

(I often change desktops to finish another task and konsole, in this case, just follows me. Can't stand it!)


- want to open it here in a shape, position defined in a list I can easilly define?

Well konq defines view profiles. This is more or less what you describe. If you open "home" or "web browser" konq can change its size. I think you could make an extra shortcut for those special cases where you have to start an application in different sizes. (Because this really is not much needed, is it?) Just like the home-icon and the earth-icon for konq on the default KDE-setup. I believe there is no need to clutter the interface with yet another drop-down menu for this.


- want to open it in a certain "application state"?

Yeah, maybe there should be a "view profiles"-tab in kcontrol for showing and editing all apps with view profiles. I can't see why not. Great idea!


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 Partly implemented

 
 by TheStick on: Mar 19 2006
 
Score 50%

Actually, you can already do some of the things you ask for in KDE. It's not exactly as complete or as intelligent as you might want it, but it's a good start.

Go to the window you want to create options for, right-click on the title bar and select "Configure window behavior".

There, you can create Settings for your program. You can select the position on the screen when launched, virtual desktop, size in pixels, etc.

You can force the settings so they take place constantly, or make them apply only when the program is initially launched.

I personally use this every day, and its great to always have my web browser launching on the 1st desktop, and not the one I was in when I clicked on the shortcut.


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 Whoops

 
 by TheStick on: Mar 19 2006
 
Score 50%

I forgot to say, once you get in "Configure window behavior", select the Window-specific settings tab.

That's where everything happens ;)


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 Re: Partly implement

 
 by nadim on: Mar 19 2006
 
Score 50%

That should make the implementation even easier!

The way you describe, though functionaly very nice, get bad usability points. maybe this would get better if we get the "flip window for options" named a few weeks ago.

Some VD have a manager where you see a small representation of the desktops and you can move the windows from VD to VD, being able to duplicate and modify the windows from such a UI would make more "lambda" users use it (and even I don't mind some UI help sometimes :)

I will play with the window specific settings.


** now, what do you want to see in an IVD? ** :)


Nadim
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 Re: Re: Partly implement

 
 by anytimeIsLunchtime on: Mar 19 2006
 
Score 50%

> Some VD have a manager where you see a small representation of the desktops and you can move the windows from VD to VD

Like... euh, KDE for example.

The Desktop Prieview & Pager can do this since a few months :-)


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 Re: Re: Re: Partly i

 
 by nadim on: Mar 19 2006
 
Score 50%

What version and and how do you access it?


Nadim.
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 kiker's pager

 
 by PreacherDave on: Mar 19 2006
 
Score 50%

KDE 3.5 has in some (not all) cases icons to represent your various windows (mostly for kde apps). And you can drag windows to other desktops for all applications.

I recently had to go back to kde3.4 temporarily and realized how much I use the dragging windows in the pager now instead of right click and send to (though I still use that when appropriate)


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 maybe slow

 
 by lenooh on: Mar 24 2006
 
Score 50%

don't you think it would use too much resources?
try resizing some windows and watch the cpu usage.
try that with firefow for example. it has to redraw the page every time you resize the window. now imagine that happening every time you change a VD.
and doing that with irc would mean different line breaks on every VD, so i guess it wouldn't be too comfortable to read.

i think for the virtual desktops have to be fast, or they are not usefull.


I'm in.
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